"Smart" weapons

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Steel Accord Steel Accord's picture
"Smart" weapons

As many of you are probably aware, the concept of a sentient or at least semi-intelligent weapon is a common device in fiction. Whether it's fully capable of speech, speaks through visions, or even something as vague as it "choosing" who wields it.

-Harry Potter's wand

-The White Ranger's sword

-Caliburn

-The Sword of Omens

-The nanosuit (Crysis)

And so on and so forth.

So this got me thinking. Could such a concept exist in Eclipse Phase?

The best way to facilitate this would probably be similar to that of a muse. Only instead of carrying the muse in your mesh inserts, it's run on the weapon's on board computer. Or one could go one step further and install the weapon with a ghostrider module and carry a fully sapient infomorph at their hip or on their back.

The weapon mind could offer the wielder things such as tactical advice, enemy count, another set of sensors, or maybe just companionship. Not like some people preferring their weapon to a flesh and blood person for company is a new phenomenon. XD

Your passion is power. Focus it.
Your body is a tool. Hone it.
Transhummanity is a pantheon. Exalt it!

ShadowDragon8685 ShadowDragon8685's picture
Um... Yeah, sure?

Um... Yeah, sure?

This is as simple as using the Combination Items rules to combine your laser rifle with an ecto. For a mere 250 credits more, your laser rifle can be running a muse or even an AGI/Infomorph. I'm not sure why you'd want it to, but nothing at all is preventing it.

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Steel Accord Steel Accord's picture
Rule of Cool

Just something to give a character a little more distinctiveness. Imagine a pair of siblings that the Sentinels run into and one of them turns out be his brother or sister's handgun or something.

EP isn't about why, it's about why not?! XD

Your passion is power. Focus it.
Your body is a tool. Hone it.
Transhummanity is a pantheon. Exalt it!

ShadowDragon8685 ShadowDragon8685's picture
No reason you can't have a

No reason you can't have a pruned fork of a sibling as a muse, or animating your weapon. Or even a full-scale alpha fork, though I can't imagine many folks would want to be a handgun full-time.

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ORCACommander ORCACommander's picture
got flashbacks to soul eater.

got flashbacks to soul eater. And then there is the sticky part about smart missiles and other explosives. essentially suicide bombers on an assembly line

godmoney godmoney's picture
soul eater came to mind as

soul eater came to mind as well. with smart materials it wouldnt be too hard to work it out like that.

can smart materials obtain a diamond equivalent structure? smart vacsuit or whatnot?

Semper Ubi Sub Ubi!?!

Steel Accord Steel Accord's picture
You'd be surprised.

That's why I said pehaps it should just be a muse with an external drive.

Although you never know in this setting! XD

And hey, I wouldn't mind spending part-time as a sword or staff.

Your passion is power. Focus it.
Your body is a tool. Hone it.
Transhummanity is a pantheon. Exalt it!

Steel Accord Steel Accord's picture
Bad side

Well yeah, that would be a kind of twisted perversion of my idea.

Although that only further gives me the idea as a story concept where my weapon buddy and I go on an Iron Man like mission to destroy the evil men who stole our weapons!

Your passion is power. Focus it.
Your body is a tool. Hone it.
Transhummanity is a pantheon. Exalt it!

Steel Accord Steel Accord's picture
Soul Eater

Never played sadly. Is it fun?

Your passion is power. Focus it.
Your body is a tool. Hone it.
Transhummanity is a pantheon. Exalt it!

ORCACommander ORCACommander's picture
its an anime not a game :P if

its an anime not a game :P if you have netflix its on there :)

ShadowDragon8685 ShadowDragon8685's picture
Steel Accord wrote:And hey, I

Steel Accord wrote:
And hey, I wouldn't mind spending part-time as a sword or staff.

I imagine it would be more or less like spending time as any other infomorph, honestly. How "aware" of itself is a sword or a staff? And if they implanted sensors to give it a physical sense of itself, that might compromise the integrity of the weapon, although it might not.

Even if it didn't, though, what would be the point? That would just make the infomorph within a captive of a morph they had no control over. That seems like it would be a lot of torment.

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Steel Accord Steel Accord's picture
Ouch!

Well for a comedic purpose, it would be hilarious to hear a weapon protest every time you used it!

"Ow! Mind the reco- Ow!"

And I don't know, would give me new perspective for whenever I practiced my techniques. I'll have felt where the blade is when I finish a follow through stroke. Just another of the plethora of novelty experiences one could have in this setting.

The infomorph or muse in question could fulfill a number of functions in close combat. On board sensors could detect weak points and straining in armor from impact vibrations. Just acting as another pair of eyes alone would be a life saver when fighting multiple foes. Plus, depending on your weapon's configuration and mods, can act without you holding it.

A gun that know's your it's friend won't fire if someone steals them from you. Or they might be able to shock anyone they feel isn't up to any good. An unthinking IFF can't choose for itself as the situation changes who can use it, this could.

Your passion is power. Focus it.
Your body is a tool. Hone it.
Transhummanity is a pantheon. Exalt it!

ORCACommander ORCACommander's picture
oh btw let me twist and

oh btw let me twist and pervert your idea soe more.put two ectos into the warhead 1 is your operator and the other is an informoph you wish to psychologically torture. the victim is in a read only mode of any sensory information. the operative controls the warhead. the operative then strikes at people close to the victim. the emergency far caster send out the victim and operative. the victim knows their body slew their friends and was unable to control himself. the key is the victim is unaware of the operator

Steel Accord Steel Accord's picture
Horrible

Okay, good motivation for me to find the bastard and do worse to him!

Your passion is power. Focus it.
Your body is a tool. Hone it.
Transhummanity is a pantheon. Exalt it!

ORCACommander ORCACommander's picture
meh i will just give him some

meh i will just give him some hallucinatory disorder where what ever he thinks he is does to me he actually thinks is doing it to himself. visually auditorially tacitly. and if you have to restore from a back up old enough you would never have remembered the torture to begin with

uwtartarus uwtartarus's picture
Emergency farcasters have

Emergency farcasters have antimatter in them. Seems awfully excessive to shoot them as a missile at people.

Exhuman, and Humanitarian.

Steel Accord Steel Accord's picture
Good

Well at least the sickos have an issue of PRACTICALITY if not morality!

Your passion is power. Focus it.
Your body is a tool. Hone it.
Transhummanity is a pantheon. Exalt it!

ORCACommander ORCACommander's picture
who says its not an anti

who says its not an anti matter war head but i would admit it would be better for their ectos to survive detonation and still be running full sensory and then the EF being activated.

and an EF has a very small amount of anti matter in it so while expensive yes still probably expensive than bunch of uranium

uwtartarus uwtartarus's picture
Right but there needs to be

Right but there needs to be cheaper ways to toture people.

Exhuman, and Humanitarian.

ShadowDragon8685 ShadowDragon8685's picture
There is. You can start by

There is. You can start by just running them through simulspace simulations of all of the above.

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Kojak Kojak's picture
I imagine the main use of

I imagine the main use of having a "smart" gun is that it would give the gun discretion, so to speak. For example, to limit collateral damage it could essentially not fire every time it would hit something that isn't your target (presumably represented in-game by having any shots that fail their rolls not actually fire at all).

"I wonder if in some weird Freudian way, Kojak was sucking on his own head."
- Steve Webster on Kojak's lollipop

Steel Accord Steel Accord's picture
Good point

That's exactly the kind of thing I was going for.

Your passion is power. Focus it.
Your body is a tool. Hone it.
Transhummanity is a pantheon. Exalt it!

Armoured Armoured's picture
I have no hands but I must kill...

I would think that being sleeved into a weapon would be a horrific experience. Having pain receptors wired into a staff or blade would mean that is all they felt, and why would anyone (other than masochists) want that? There is a really good reason synthmorphs suffer one less level of wounds.. no pain receptors to distract you.

In any case for the sleeved ego to be useful though, you would need sensors of some sort to be useful in identifying enemies, but that means to some extent you would identify yourself as the weapon.. and everything that goes with it. Being pointed at something just so you can kill it. Feeling yourself cutting through some poor bastard who just had the security shift that day. Becoming covered in blood and being unable to get it off.

That sounds pretty sociopathic, or a good way to rack up SV.

I'm all for a smart weapon in the case of firearms, but there is no reason smart-targeting couldn't be governed by a simple machine AI. Something at Muse-level could distinguish between friend and foe, you don't need a transhuman ego for that job. As for swords and guns not working when someone else picks them up, that is what bio-locks or access codes are for. No need to have someone stuck in a weapon that can easily be stolen.

Steel Accord Steel Accord's picture
Muses

Which is why I keep saying, that muses WOULD be ideal for this role. The ghost-riding thing was just an idea.

I was looking at a bunch of fictional examples of sentient weapons, some are good, some are evil. The good ones never seem to mind that much though.

Your passion is power. Focus it.
Your body is a tool. Hone it.
Transhummanity is a pantheon. Exalt it!

Kremlin K.O.A. Kremlin K.O.A.'s picture
ShadowDragon8685 wrote:There

ShadowDragon8685 wrote:
There is. You can start by just running them through simulspace simulations of all of the above.

At 60x accelerated subjective time.

Armoured wrote:
I would think that being sleeved into a weapon would be a horrific experience. Having pain receptors wired into a staff or blade would mean that is all they felt, and why would anyone (other than masochists) want that? There is a really good reason synthmorphs suffer one less level of wounds.. no pain receptors to distract you.

That's easy, wire the impact receptors to the pleasure centre instead. Only wire up the structural damage sensors to the pain centre.

ORCACommander ORCACommander's picture
ya but the simulspace details

ya but the simulspace details could easily be gotten wrong. if they catch just one thing out of place the illusion will be broken

Erulastant Erulastant's picture
Kremlin K.O.A. wrote:Armoured

Kremlin K.O.A. wrote:

Armoured wrote:
I would think that being sleeved into a weapon would be a horrific experience. Having pain receptors wired into a staff or blade would mean that is all they felt, and why would anyone (other than masochists) want that? There is a really good reason synthmorphs suffer one less level of wounds.. no pain receptors to distract you.

That's easy, wire the impact receptors to the pleasure centre instead. Only wire up the structural damage sensors to the pain centre.


That...might have some unwanted side effects...

You, too, were made by humans. The methods used were just cruder, imprecise. I guess that explains a lot.

EtherExsurgent EtherExsurgent's picture
Check out the new Rogue Trooper Comic

The new Rogue Trooper comic series has an interesting take on weapons with an uploaded person in them. He also has a couple of other pieces of equipment that a person has been uploaded too. In the story its the only way he could save some other members of his squad. Comic is produced by IDW this time not 2000 AD Comics.

ShadowDragon8685 ShadowDragon8685's picture
Erulastant wrote:Kremlin K.O

Erulastant wrote:
Kremlin K.O.A. wrote:

Armoured wrote:
I would think that being sleeved into a weapon would be a horrific experience. Having pain receptors wired into a staff or blade would mean that is all they felt, and why would anyone (other than masochists) want that? There is a really good reason synthmorphs suffer one less level of wounds.. no pain receptors to distract you.

That's easy, wire the impact receptors to the pleasure centre instead. Only wire up the structural damage sensors to the pain centre.


That...might have some unwanted side effects...

Nothing quite like conditioning a person to feel intense euphoria when they slice through flesh, impact on a head, eh?

I can see some potential problems with that.

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Erulastant Erulastant's picture
ShadowDragon wrote:

ShadowDragon wrote:

Nothing quite like conditioning a person to feel intense euphoria when they slice through flesh, impact on a head, eh?

I can see some potential problems with that.


I was more thinking about how your sword having an orgasm mid-fight might be distracting to the wielder... But yeah, that's an issue too.

You, too, were made by humans. The methods used were just cruder, imprecise. I guess that explains a lot.

ShadowDragon8685 ShadowDragon8685's picture
Erulastant wrote:ShadowDragon

Erulastant wrote:
ShadowDragon wrote:

Nothing quite like conditioning a person to feel intense euphoria when they slice through flesh, impact on a head, eh?

I can see some potential problems with that.


I was more thinking about how your sword having an orgasm mid-fight might be distracting to the wielder... But yeah, that's an issue too.

Unless you wired up speakers in the crossguard and your sword is given to immodest, screaming orgasms, that's probably a nonissue. Or maybe the metaphorical you is the kind of person who likes that, I dunno. You're the screaming lunatic who sleeved someone into your sword and then wired them up to feel pleasure when they hurt people, fuck knows what gets you off!

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Erulastant Erulastant's picture
Presumably your weapon is

Presumably your weapon is connected to your tacnet. Assuming it's friendly.

You, too, were made by humans. The methods used were just cruder, imprecise. I guess that explains a lot.

ShadowDragon8685 ShadowDragon8685's picture
Erulastant wrote:Presumably

Erulastant wrote:
Presumably your weapon is connected to your tacnet. Assuming it's friendly.

Aye, but even so, if it isn't screaming its multiple, physical-violence-based orgasms into the tacnet, it's probably not going to be an issue. And if it's distracting you, your muse can filter it out.

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Chernoborg Chernoborg's picture
Douglas Adams did it first!

This reminds me of the Heart of Gold from Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy. The Sirius Cybernetics Corporation installed Genuine People Personalities into EVERYTHING onboard, such that the doors would say "thank you" and sigh contentedly while closing. Generally this didn't improve things as Sirius Cybernetics Corporation products are really ,incredibly faulty!

On occasion I've toyed with the idea of a "muse doll" inspired by Sumomo from Chobits. The basic concept is an small, relatively weak morph for the muse to interact with children before they are transferred to their internal mesh inserts. Some adults still use their dolls but are viewed as oddballs and a bit immature.

Current Status: Highly Distracted building Gatecrashing systems in Universe Sandbox!

Aldrich Aldrich's picture
Chernoborg wrote:On occasion

Chernoborg wrote:
On occasion I've toyed with the idea of a "muse doll" inspired by Sumomo from Chobits. The basic concept is an small, relatively weak morph for the muse to interact with children before they are transferred to their internal mesh inserts. Some adults still use their dolls but are viewed as oddballs and a bit immature.

Annnnd I'm totally stealing this for my next game. AI nannies inhabiting children's toys. Which will also make for an excellent horror vibe when they get corrupted by a TITAN or exsurgent virus!

ThatWhichNeverWas ThatWhichNeverWas's picture
...

ShadowDragon8685 wrote:
Aye, but even so, if it isn't screaming its multiple, physical-violence-based orgasms into the tacnet, it's probably not going to be an issue.

Ahhh, next generation psychological warfare. Devilish cunning!

Chernoborg wrote:
I've toyed with the idea of a "muse doll"

Isn't that basically just a Creepy?

In the past we've had to compensate for weaknesses, finding quick solutions that only benefit a few.
But what if we never need to feel weak or morally conflicted again?

Chernoborg Chernoborg's picture
Hey yeah, I see that. They

Hey yeah, I see that. They sound a bit more mechanical than I was thinking . More like a plush toy made of smart fabric, puts a interesting spin on Calvin and Hobbes! Or, for a darker turn, an async with multiple personality disorder routing their alternate persona through an innocent looking toy.

Current Status: Highly Distracted building Gatecrashing systems in Universe Sandbox!

Smokeskin Smokeskin's picture
Kojak wrote:I imagine the

Kojak wrote:
I imagine the main use of having a "smart" gun is that it would give the gun discretion, so to speak. For example, to limit collateral damage it could essentially not fire every time it would hit something that isn't your target (presumably represented in-game by having any shots that fail their rolls not actually fire at all).

I think it was a Michael Marshal novel, all the guns had legal AIs in them. They had settings from "Self defense" to "First degree murder" and wouldn't fire you would get a conviction higher than what it was set to.

Of course, everyone kept their guns on "First degree murder" so the gun would fire when they wanted to. The author has a way with words that I don't, I laughed when I read that :)

Aldrich Aldrich's picture
Smokeskin wrote:Kojak wrote:I

Smokeskin wrote:
Kojak wrote:
I imagine the main use of having a "smart" gun is that it would give the gun discretion, so to speak. For example, to limit collateral damage it could essentially not fire every time it would hit something that isn't your target (presumably represented in-game by having any shots that fail their rolls not actually fire at all).

I think it was a Michael Marshal novel, all the guns had legal AIs in them. They had settings from "Self defense" to "First degree murder" and wouldn't fire you would get a conviction higher than what it was set to.

Of course, everyone kept their guns on "First degree murder" so the gun would fire when they wanted to. The author has a way with words that I don't, I laughed when I read that :)

You could also take the Psycho Pass approach, wherein the guns have to phone home to the central police AI that authorizes lethal force before they'll disengage the safety. Of course the AI was also judge and jury. I've considered throwing in a city that utilizes such a system so that I can play around with a utilitarian dystopia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psycho-Pass (pretty decent series, I think it's still on Hulu?)